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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Anon ()
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| Company: |
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| Interesting article - thanks for sharing. My own experience of HH's is mixed; some (or shall I say a very few) are very polite, straight-forward and honest. Others are simply vultures who are imho, akin to the much loathed estate agents who were much villiansed not too long ago. I have now come to expect certain HH's not to return calls and emails and on the very rare occasion that they phone or email, I have to, through gritted teeth, be polite to them in the vain hope that they will present an opportunity. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
A Reputable Headhunter ()
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| Company: |
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| Sadly this practice does exist in some cases but what needs to be appreciated is that different tiers exist in the headhunting and recruitment industry. The best, most professional firms are retained by their small group of clients to identify and attract the best candidates for any specific position. So called 'ambulance chasing' is a practice sometimes adopted by recruiters lower down the food chain who are more candidate driven and so will get hold of a good person and then use them to open as many doors as possible.
Headhunter is a term often used as a catch all for the recruitment industry and this is not the case. Any candidate should take the time to identify the best headhunting firms in any sector and be very selective about who they speak to. You many then find that we are not all as bad as people seem to want to report. The best firms face a constant challenge to cement their reputation as being honest and professional and a world away from some of the shadier operators in the industry. It would be nice to see this recognised in print once in a while. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
giles.percy ()
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| Company: |
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| This is not news. Even when a HH has a genuine opportunity, they will often pump for names of old employers in order to increase their leads. Most headhunters are salesmen who sell people, and will do whatever it takes to "always be closing".
Recruitment is a numbers game for most agencies, because it is a pretty effective strategy. You trawl for CVs, get leads, arrange interviews, and then make a sale on a proportion of those meetings. Your preferences as a candidate are irrelevent when the supply of candidates is large, and the number of jobs is small.
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Anon ()
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| Company: |
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| I had the exact same experience with what I am pretty sure is the same HH....Got the call at some very odd hour asking for who I have interviewed with and all...also had my CV with them for weeks but never received a phone call for specific roles...yet they advertise the most front office jobs amongst all HHs I have come across....this HH needs to know that people are clocking on to their devious ways. If there was any ounce of regulation in place, these guys will out of business no time...they are that bad
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
anon ()
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| Company: |
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| I get the call every few weeks, definite one way street on the information flow......funny enough, I spoke with one of "the team" his morning, once again a waste of my time. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
In-house recruiter ()
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| Company: |
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| Here's how the model works at this grubby, non-retained end of the recruitment market. So-called headhunter taps you up on your other interviews, then sends in his own candidates in the hope they'll edge you out of the interview process. So-called headhunter gains names of your interviewers who he earmarks as potential clients OR candidates. So-called headhunter also garners enough info from you to be able to advertise the vacancy himself. So-called headhunter watches as the new CVs roll in, in response to his (semi) made-up advert, for a firm he's not mandated by, and probably has never met. And then he calls up all those new advert respondees, and taps them up too... |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Anon II ()
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| Company: |
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| Even if people clock in on their evil ways, if they are presented with the right opportunity, I don't think a candidate would turn it down due to the reputation of the HH. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Anon ()
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| Company: |
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| I know who you are talking about. They are so unprofessional and absolutely USELESS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
ANON ()
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| Company: |
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| It is very interesting - but very old news.
This is a typical case of a bad experience ruining the industry. Unfortunately though, no matter what happens recruiters are needed in a very big way.
All I would say is......would you buy a car from Asda? If the answer is yes, you get what you pay for.......
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
ChasDarwin ()
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| Company: |
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| 100% right. I'm looking for work at the moment. At least twice had recruitment conultants ring up and pump me for names at past employers and what other jobs I've been put up for. With the excise that "they build a negtwork of contacts and the more names they have the better it is for everyone and where all scrathing each others backs" and so on." One said he was going to send me a Job spec never got it. You can tell the difference between recruitment firms, the crap ones sound way desperate. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
last in first out ()
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| Company: |
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| Same experience here, i wasted a lot of time, money and efforts trying to get a job with these HHs, they never get back to you, few of hem reply to emails and Yes I had the same questions from HHs: which firm have you interviewed with? who is the person responsible and what was the outcome? After answering those questions, I have never heard from these guys again,,,,it is sad that we the people who studied hard at Uni, worked hard and being unlucky to be made redundant to fall in the hands of these HHs who play a game with us. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
joker ()
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| Company: |
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| Is it Foxtons? |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
me ()
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| Company: |
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| Oh my God! the lack of manners is going to kill us all!. If someone is working in HH has to be polite, has to be nice and has to come back to the candidate with the truth of what didn't work. But HH are indeed a bunch of liars, and people who mostly don't have a degree and didn't manage to sell houses (of course there are exceptions thanks God). And you are being recruited for a nice senior job. Imagine what you find if you are looking for a junior position or a secretarial job 'know w'a mean?' ... Bless. Wherever you look there is this bunch of 'wanna be' anything but educated people. Sad future. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Aussie ()
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| Company: |
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| Unfortunately, I think this is more widespread than people realise. Some reputable agencies have tried "tapping" me up for details and I now just refuse to help them. One agency phoned and described this great job they had, spent 15 minutes talking to me on the phone about the role and then right at the end asked if I was interviewing elsewhere. They claimed they wanted to know names to make sure it wasn't the same company as the job they had on offer. Of course when I said to them to tell me the company name for the role they had, they refused to and said they would send through the spec. Surprise surprise, it never arrived.
Sorry but recruitment agents/HHs deserve their reputation and with the market tightening up I am sure we will see even more desperate and underhanded tactics from them. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Hector ()
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| Company: |
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| Headhunters :- Some good ones. The rest are like cockroaches in need of eradication. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
pimpjui ()
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| Company: |
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| It's like any other profession. Some HH are good, and don't need to be shady. And they will have genuine information that you won't. Others are flunky parasites, who could not do anything else except broker in fear. Either way, if you are a good candiadate, you won't need them. Find the company you want to work for directly, even if it means weeks of your own research. Then figure out how to get to the decision maker. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Recruitment Consultant ()
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| Company: |
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| One will always tell more people of a bad experience than a good experience and this is a simple rule of business, hence the bad reputation of recruitment consultants.
There are a lot of cowboys in all industries including recruitment and they tar us all with the same brush. At my company we do indeed ask people who they've worked with in the past, references etc to build up our databases, we then cold call these people and introduce ourselves, however we are not underhand about what we do and if people don't want to give us the names they don't.
My advice would be to find a good recruitment consultant and stick with them, there are a lot out there and it is just detrimental to yourself to be so paranoid about the whole process. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
duh ()
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| Company: |
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| ChasDarwin: try tightening up your syntax / spelling and you might have more luck in the job market. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Matt ()
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| Company: |
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| Dog eat dog hit it on the mark. These are tough times, so expect people to have the knives out looking for their steak. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
honest headhunter ()
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| Company: |
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| Sadly this happens far too often in the industry with shady recruiters. But it is not really these bottom-feeders who are to blame. Ultimately, they could never exist in business unless the banks accepted CV's sent in on spec by firms they have no relationship with.
Those of us who do work in reputable firms, value client relationships and put in time and effort are always aghast and astonished when a CV spec'd in from some never heard of cowboy outfit gets the job and all our efforts are for nought.
Very simply - Banks just want candidates and don't really care who provides them. If they did - these sharks would find closed doors at the banks and be out of business in days. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Comtrader ()
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| Company: |
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| i have a worry that everyone is talking about the same HH here whose name starts with a S? I am assuming we cant mention names? |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
pranitakumar ()
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| Company: |
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| Well, we all do cross the line once in a while, but its the same practice followed by most industries which are sales driven.
The best way to go about looking for a job is to identify an agency which is strong in your area of expertise & has some good client base from the same domain or segment of industry. Thus at any given point they can genuinely refer you on to multiple positions . All you need to do is to go thru their website & see if any of their clients could be your potential employers and then approach the firm, resulting in a meanigful discussion. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Pragma ()
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| Company: |
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| Shouldn't the Recruitment & Employment Confederation have a role on this? |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Moksha ()
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| Company: |
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| I have experienced this 3 times in last two months. I think most of them have come down to this level. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Formerly unemployed ()
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| Company: |
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| This has happened to me a few times, all from one very well known firm. You know who you are. Really made my day to hear your idea of sending bogus info their way. Candidates should not give this kind of information to lazy hh's simply out of politeness. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Bored ()
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| Company: |
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| It is obvious that desperation has settled in when so many people feel the need to consistently attack and generalise headhunters. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
James Frew ()
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| Company: |
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| So, we have bankers accusing the recruitment industry of lax morals. I cannot imagine a more perfect example of pots calling kettles black. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Patronising Pete ()
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| Company: |
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| For a financial website the tone of this article and the posts exhibits a surprising degree of naivety of basic economics. Didn’t your mothers teach you that nothing in this life comes for free? The same applies to the candidate recruiter relationship. They provide you with a service which includes the distribution and marketing of your CV, the arrangement of interviews, and the closing of the process. In return you pay for this service. As a minimum the consideration you pay will comprise information about your career history. This info. is valuable to the recruiter as he use it to obtain a recruitment fee. You may decide to pay additional consideration in the form of other information such as the names of interviewers at the companies you have visited. But to hand over valuable information to anyone who asks is akin to dishing out £5 notes to people on the street. You would hesitate to pay more than the minimum required deposit in advance for any service, especially if you had not already built up a trusted relationship with the vendor. The same approach should be adopted with recruiters - If he sounds like he wears pointy shoes, don’t pay more that the bare minimum in advance. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Anon2 ()
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| Company: |
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| Can't live with em, can't live without em. They are working for you on some roles and against you at the same time ie pitching other candidates against the jobs you have already applied for with other recruitment agencies. Best to keep things vague as possible but possibly not lie, if you still need their help. |
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| Date: |
15 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Anon ()
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| Company: |
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| First time I am seeing this in print and it is so true. While I was out of work, I had the misfortune of wasting travelcard money on seeing so many of these guys who apparently had roles, only to never hear from them again.
One big name passed me on to three different colleagues in the hope that I'd divulge who my previous boss was. It's unfortunate that these guys are making the most of people's desperation.
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| Date: |
16 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
ChasDarwin ()
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| Company: |
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| duh - has anyone ever got a job off this comment section? Maybe, but I wasn't trying too right now. It would be interesting if they had. |
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| Date: |
16 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
jobhunters ()
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| Company: |
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| Not a big issue..
Probably just give them a couple of names which have been rejected (by the company or urself). Anyway, i've sent hundereds of applications every month, how can i remember???
If they were fake, what can go wrong, since those companies rejected u anyway.
If they we're right, u get ur CV sent ten times to the same employer. Nothing wrong as well.
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| Date: |
16 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Happy ()
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| Company: |
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| Joe, Like alot of people out there we have all been made redundant once in our lives. It's not a pleasant experience when you need to approach recruitment agencies and they make you feel like a no-body when you have many years experience behind you (especially when a girl/boy out of nappies interviews you!). I now live in Sydney but made a massive mistake by joining a recruitment agency (MP) when I first arrived. I soon handed in my notice after only 5 months when I also was one of those who had to ask those type of questions. I totally hated this approach. It's all just a numbers game with these people and the only happy people are the shareholders (well maybe not anymore). Joe, stick to the smaller guys who have survived the up's and down's of the markets or even better COME TO SYDNEY... |
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| Date: |
16 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Formerly unemployed ()
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| Company: |
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| Bored, If anyone is desperate it is the recruitment firms using these tactics.The "generalisations" that you speak of are mentioned because generally hh's act in this way. I think everyone acknowledges that good hh's do exist - but they are very much the exception. Expect to be seen in the same way as estate agents and traffic wardens until the recruitment industry is cleaned up. |
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| Date: |
16 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
In-house headhunter ()
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| Company: |
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| To claim there's "nothing wrong" with the same CV being sent to the same employer 10 times is rather naive...If I received the same CV through multiple sources, it would without doubt negatively impact on my view of the candidate. First up, it smacks of desperation, naivity about the recruitment process, and an inability to choose the right intermediaries. Secondly, if I went on to hire the candidate, it would mean a fee dispute between all the recruiters who'd sent his/her CV over - something all hiring firms are desperate to avoid. I appreciate that being a job hunter in this market is tough, but to maximize your chance of securing interviews and offers, you need to work with the right recruitment intermediaries, and that means you MUST be selective. |
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| Date: |
16 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Derivatives Maniac ()
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| Company: |
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| HH have been doing this for ages. I had this kind of experience back in 2005 already - I usually like to fool them by giving them some crappy name.. From my experience the biggest agencies are the biggest cons. |
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| Date: |
16 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Axesss ()
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| Company: |
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| Would it be asking for too much if you (who had bad experiences with HH) can post the names of those unprofessional HH??
I know this forum is not about bashing a particular firm but it just helps by not wasting time with an HH who is from the word go wasting your time (and rightly penalizes or rewards for their professionalism or lack of it in HH industry).
I worked with a few HH, and realized it was utter waste of time. They start with 20 various questions - where, what, whwhy etc etc kind of work you would want. Want to meet you in person. Then keep you waiting for next 4 weeks about a specific role. You chase them for weeks and only to hear 'that role is on hold now' ... God knows if that ever existed in the first place or was just a fake one ... Saying this since it happened 7-8 times ... otherwise, it's just too much of a coincidence!!
Can't believe people can be this bad!
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| Date: |
16 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
1Quant ()
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| Company: |
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| Folks,
I wrote a comment about this issue last year. I was particularly peeved about recruitment agencies advertising non-existent jobs on the site.
A very simple solution is available, folks. It is the ebay model - let people leave feedback on these so-called recruitment agencies. We all know who they are. In addition, Ms. Sarah Butcher can actually do some work and check that the jobs being advertised on the site are real jobs. Of course, a random sample will do. This will drastically reduce the amount of bogus jobs on the site. In addition, efc will benefit as people will know that it is a one-stop centre for "sure-jobs"
Before you start going - well well, how do you gauge the feedback, simple checks can be incorporated : someone can actually verify the details of the person(s) leaving the feedback.
As a final resort, their day of reckoning is coming. Estate agents are about to start getting regulated, I can imagine that HH, Recruitment agencies and their ilk will be next. |
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| Date: |
17 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Blame culture? ()
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| Company: |
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| Always someone else's fault, eh chaps? I enjoy reading these articles immensely over a sandwich at my (HH'ing) desk - please keep the comments coming, you all seem to have plenty of time on your hands..... |
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| Date: |
17 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Blessed ()
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| Company: |
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| There are good and bad elements in every profession, but unfortunately in this respeect the recruitment business sways more towards the bad.
I've registered with so many agencies over the last year and met a mixture of all sorts, but it gets to a point where you can easily discern them just by asking a few questions. At times I'm so amazed at how ill-equipped some are to do the job, with very little skill, knowledge and technique.
I would advise researching agencies before submitting your CV, and try not to post your CV on websites, where any Tom, Dick or .......can gain possession of your details.
Referrals are good, hence it's worth talking to friends and colleagues who have developed good relationships with certain reliable agents/agencies.
My question is - who regulates these guys?
Something needs to be done immediately; free market or not, their activities still need monitoring, and those at fault reprimanded. |
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| Date: |
24 Jul 2008
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| Name/Email: |
Jack Straw ()
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| Company: |
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| Jesus but you whine for someone who until recently was busily engaged in the destruction of the banking system for your own benefit.
It really is unseemly. You were tough enough to participate in the screwing of the century, now you have to deal with a few little stratagems from a head hunter and your poor fragile psyche feels offended.
Get used to it Master of the Universe |
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